tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post9074522115429847549..comments2023-10-10T08:02:18.073-04:00Comments on Rationally Speaking: Newt, anti-intellectualism, and family valuesUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger28125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-66320479377086055442011-12-27T14:28:55.764-05:002011-12-27T14:28:55.764-05:00Ian,
no, I don't think I am byung into slande...Ian,<br /><br />no, I don't think I am byung into slander over substantive critique, I am simply pointing out that the *voters* are hypocritical (not just the candidate).Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09099460671669064269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-48169854844253087862011-12-27T13:22:42.669-05:002011-12-27T13:22:42.669-05:00Right, the problem is that by pointing out this pe...Right, the problem is that by pointing out this personal hypocrisy you are implicitly accepting certain terms of political debate, terms that favour slander over substantive critique.ianpollockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15579140807988796286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-39681528637882303972011-12-25T10:37:52.859-05:002011-12-25T10:37:52.859-05:00Ian,
according to recent polls Gingrich is the fr...Ian,<br /><br />according to recent polls Gingrich is the frontrunner, though party insiders' keep predicting that eventually Romney will be the last man standing.<br /><br />As for the personal stuff, it is clearly relevant when a politician (and, even more, the voters who support him) makes a big deal out of "family values." A better example than his divorce papers, of course, is his affair with an intern while calling for the impeachment of Clinton based on the latter's affair with an intern...Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09099460671669064269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-77594189103384178912011-12-25T00:38:04.733-05:002011-12-25T00:38:04.733-05:00Once again the prevalence of gossip about politici...Once again the prevalence of gossip about politician's personal lives flabbergasts me. I dislike Gingrich, but it's all too easy to spin something like divorce proceedings. My parents went through a divorce. Do you know how damned easy it would be for me to frame true facts about their divorce in such a way as to make one or both of them look like an asshole, if I wanted to?<br /><br />This kind of stuff is all noise & no signal.ianpollockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15579140807988796286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-14862976352712908022011-12-25T00:27:39.499-05:002011-12-25T00:27:39.499-05:00Hm, he's the frontrunner? Intrade says it'...Hm, he's the frontrunner? Intrade says it's Mitt Romney for sure...ianpollockhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15579140807988796286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-39428801930422922362011-12-23T12:40:23.233-05:002011-12-23T12:40:23.233-05:0063a etc.,
wait, are you attacking what you take t...63a etc.,<br /><br />wait, are you attacking what you take to be my *implicit* claim? If you read my sentence at face value, which is the way it is meant to be read, it seems correct according to FactCheck. At any rate, as you say, it is a minor point. My broader point is that Newt is most certainly not a good example of "family values," and that value-oriented voters that support him are being hypocritical, or at the very least inconsistent.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09099460671669064269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-48445947791237139952011-12-22T21:54:48.663-05:002011-12-22T21:54:48.663-05:00No, it's a federal republic. Which by definit...No, it's a federal republic. Which by definition is democratic.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-4687448103711010912011-12-22T17:34:44.279-05:002011-12-22T17:34:44.279-05:00"it's actually a constitutional democracy..."it's actually a constitutional democracy with a republican form of government"<br /><br />The term is simply "polyarchy".Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-69685564892220275692011-12-22T15:17:30.299-05:002011-12-22T15:17:30.299-05:00Robin,
it's actually a constitutional democra...Robin,<br /><br />it's actually a constitutional democracy with a republican form of government.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09099460671669064269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-11414859040869751352011-12-22T12:29:23.669-05:002011-12-22T12:29:23.669-05:00Whoever said the US was a Democracy? It's a Re...Whoever said the US was a Democracy? It's a Republic.Robinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00055701170560201758noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-17144850666804592332011-12-22T11:45:39.401-05:002011-12-22T11:45:39.401-05:00Massimo said:
“My sentence is perfectly compatible...Massimo said:<br />“My sentence is perfectly compatible with the factcheck summary.”<br /><br />Massimo’s Sentence:<br /> “which in turn reminds us of the ugly episode of Newt serving divorce papers to his first wife while she was in the hospital with cancer.”<br /><br />FactCheck.org:<br />“For almost three decades, Newt Gingrich has been dogged by a story that he served his first wife divorce papers while she lay in a hospital bed battling — or in some versions dying from — cancer. It didn’t happen that way.”<br /><br />It’s a minor point, but the FactCheck summary does counter your sentence. Not the deathbed claim, you didn’t make that. But the implicit narrative that is conjured up with Newt serving divorce papers to his—we are lead to assume—surprised wife.<br /><br />• The divorce discussion was no surprise. You didn’t say this, but it’s implied.<br />• Legal papers were not served at the time. And signing of any list hasn’t been corroborated.<br />• Tumor removal isn’t quite “with cancer.” It’s hair-splitting, but there is a distinction.<br /><br />Your sentence would be closer to the truth, if somewhat pedantic, reworded something like:<br /><br />“which in turn reminds us of the ugly episode of Newt arguing with his first wife—though they had already separated—over details of their proceeding divorce while she was in recovery from tumor removal surgery.”<br /><br />For what it’s worth, I assure you my bias toward Newt Gingrich and GOP candidates in general, isn’t a positive one.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-79547633068239333602011-12-22T01:10:38.787-05:002011-12-22T01:10:38.787-05:00Worst analogy for Republicans and their intended v...Worst analogy for Republicans and their intended victims ever.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-2640468028170055052011-12-21T20:28:01.949-05:002011-12-21T20:28:01.949-05:00Sheldon and unknown
>"Waah, they're ...Sheldon and unknown<br /> >"Waah, they're mean!"<br /> The Eagle see's himself as 'strong' and 'swift'<br />the lamb see's the Eagle as 'evil' and 'mean'<br />The Eagle simply see's the lamb as 'weak' and 'tasty'. The weak see evil everywhere there is strength.DJDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01634608128841501265noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-8512188340194496882011-12-21T19:07:43.633-05:002011-12-21T19:07:43.633-05:00@Unknown: The idea is not so base as "Waah, t...@Unknown: The idea is not so base as "Waah, they're mean!," my friend.<br /><br />I think the point is: "That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness."<br /><br />You see? Our country must get this under control in a reasonable and rational manner because, unlike France, Russia or China, the citizens of the United States of America have a document that instructs them to reorder government when it becomes destructive toward the ends of their "unalienable Rights: Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness." Whereas the French Russians and the Chinese had the good sense to do it, Americans actually have legal precedent. And, anyone can tell you that precedent is critical in a "nation of laws." Now, Americans are a reluctant lot and this is not an idea most would sponsor casually or even in extreme curcumstances, but it can happen.<br /><br />Therefore it is incumbent upon our parties and politicians to work together to act reasonably and come to terms of agreement that satisfy the vast majority, while ensuring the protection of the minority.<br /><br />Would you like to guess who the minority would be under that kind of a scenario? Which beings do you think the pitchforks and torches will be demanding if it all goes bust? Have you read "A Tale of Two Cities?" Lovely book, remarkably lyrical prose and an incredible story. All too real.<br /><br />People can have a decent life at 75% - 25% and they won't complain much. In fact they'll be on the watch against anyone who wants to take their system apart. But at 95% - 5% that fragile minority is on its own and will receive protection from none, save those it can coerce; but that never works out very well.<br /><br />So, the point is, that this acrimonious approach by the right, beginning back in the early '80s, to start a class, cultural, and hate war, will only serve to harm their interests in the long run because, it's like Bob Dylan Said: "When you got nothin', you got nothin' to lose."<br /><br />Do you get it now?<br /><br />So, let's stop all of this foolishness and work together; it does no one any good to continue down the current path.Edwardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09348316835254259144noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-21914411666799216462011-12-21T15:03:54.207-05:002011-12-21T15:03:54.207-05:00"But hey baby, small steps first..."
Le..."But hey baby, small steps first..."<br /><br />Let us for the sake of the existence of civilization hope not.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-51816206982195269002011-12-21T08:42:54.080-05:002011-12-21T08:42:54.080-05:00Unasked,
interesting to see that your bias did no...Unasked,<br /><br />interesting to see that your bias did not permit you to read the post accurately enough, as nowhere did I write that Gingrich's wife was dying or is now dead. My sentence is perfectly compatible with the factcheck summary.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09099460671669064269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-72796408740949084162011-12-21T01:48:04.303-05:002011-12-21T01:48:04.303-05:00Interesting to see "confirmation bias"
i...Interesting to see "confirmation bias"<br />in a blog devoted to rationality. <br />See "The Gingrich Divorce Myth" at<br />FactCheck.org:<br /><br /> <a href="http://www.factcheck.org/2011/12/the-gingrich-divorce-myth/" rel="nofollow">http://www.factcheck.org/2011/12/the-gingrich-divorce-myth/</a>UnaskedQuestionshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11376400585197710515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-41111949044137188412011-12-20T22:35:32.615-05:002011-12-20T22:35:32.615-05:00Well said, Professor.
I recall when the differenc...Well said, Professor.<br /><br />I recall when the differences between the parties were "workable" differences... it felt that each party represented relatively rational points of view, and that they could, ultimately, work together. Unfortunately it hasn't been that way for a long time. As you said, its just become incredibly aggressive and confrontational. These are incredibly scary times we live in.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-32416342564786916532011-12-20T21:50:29.948-05:002011-12-20T21:50:29.948-05:00@Unknown,
yes, they are mean! And their policies ...@Unknown,<br />yes, they are mean! And their policies harm this country. You got a problem with those facts?Sheldonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04604847159462215168noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-25714481848537264952011-12-20T20:38:08.366-05:002011-12-20T20:38:08.366-05:00I appreciate the article and how it attempts to un...I appreciate the article and how it attempts to understand the underpinnings of modern republican "thought" (if you can call it that).<br /><br />As for a 3rd party, we don't need a moderate one. We just need one with the same ideals Obama ran and won on in 2008. It will be a landslide (assuming we can overcome the fact that 3/4 of U.S. voting machines are now blackbox, proprietary electronic paperless machines owned and operated by one private corporation - ES&S - which is owned by a republican).Craig Everett Joneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08552330614297665373noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-85648907833558176572011-12-20T15:58:11.841-05:002011-12-20T15:58:11.841-05:00So, the point of this post is... complaining about...So, the point of this post is... complaining about Republicans? Whining that they don't play fair? I'm not sure what the point is, but all I hear is, "Waah, they're mean!"Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16261883153544804213noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-89665682992105200732011-12-20T15:41:57.355-05:002011-12-20T15:41:57.355-05:00jeremybee
"DJD, It's ironic that you kee...jeremybee<br /> "DJD, It's ironic that you keep on teaching when long ago you stopped learning."<br /> Did I say something which you disagree with?DJDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01634608128841501265noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-18513807404079342172011-12-20T15:27:14.011-05:002011-12-20T15:27:14.011-05:00DJD, It's ironic that you keep on teaching whe...DJD, It's ironic that you keep on teaching when long ago you stopped learning.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-45518145256000041152011-12-20T15:11:57.375-05:002011-12-20T15:11:57.375-05:00Kind of rronic that this essay by Massimo appears ...Kind of rronic that this essay by Massimo appears one week after his essay on "The Entanglement Between Biology And Ideology" where he points out how science has a history of "being used for nefarious ideological purposes"DJDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01634608128841501265noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-86160942680527110212011-12-20T10:25:17.864-05:002011-12-20T10:25:17.864-05:00Or maybe we could finally have a viable third part...<i>Or maybe we could finally have a viable third party whose candidates can get on the ballot in all 50 states.</i><br /><br />That puts a different twist on "spoiler alert." <br /><br />Until the voting system is reformed (i.e. converted from "winner takes all" to some version of ranked voting, like IRV), the logic of lesser-evil reigns (and ought to, in my opinion).<br /><br /><i>though frankly the idea of a “moderate” party that strikes a middle way between completely crazy (the current GOP) and sold out to Wall Street (the current Dems) isn’t exactly one to get excited about</i><br /><br />That's putting it mildly. No dilemma there. :-)mufihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01818949854678769391noreply@blogger.com