tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post2298482045215379873..comments2023-10-10T08:02:18.073-04:00Comments on Rationally Speaking: Massimo's PicksUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger76125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-6055346844629797142010-03-21T17:19:48.043-04:002010-03-21T17:19:48.043-04:00Ci,
Good. :) Maybe less words would have been ...Ci, <br /><br />Good. :) Maybe less words would have been better..calianahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06702074438747578526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-16893108200426211402010-03-20T18:02:37.992-04:002010-03-20T18:02:37.992-04:00Oh, well now I'm convinced.Oh, well now I'm convinced.Jeff Eygeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11967707883565162538noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-21289889933149116762010-03-20T12:48:30.525-04:002010-03-20T12:48:30.525-04:00Ci "You are quite wrong, and that's all t...Ci "You are quite wrong, and that's all there is to it. It is a ubiquitous belief within the evangelical subculture."<br /><br />Well I'm just not familiar with it. If I believed it I certainly wouldn't be here talking you, would I. Do these people support this belief with scripture? Do you know what the scripture is? <br /><br />I do believe that every person is judged after they die - Christians included. "1 Peter 4:6 For the gospel has for this purpose been preached even to those who are dead, that though they are judged in the flesh as men, they may live in the spirit according to the will of God."<br /><br />And the part about people being delighted when others end up in Hell? I think God wouldn't be pleased with that attitude. But tho the Bible says that 'God takes no pleasure in the death of the wicked' it is true as well from the unbelieving persons point of view that: "So, because they shall have eternally what they desired (life apart from God), it shall be eternal punishment” (Matthew. Fowler p. 607). The point being made is that God respects the free-willed choice of every individual, and those who chose to live without God will get their wish, yet there are serious consequences of an existence apart from God, including an existence completely removed from God’s blessings, which include everything necessary for happiness (Revelation 21:4). http://www.ch-of-christ.beaverton.or.us/Why_Does_Hell_Exist.htm<br /><br />The most concise set of verses on this matter in the Bible says this: <br /><br />11 Say to them, As I live, declares YHWH the lord, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but that the wicked turn from his way and live; turn back, turn back from your evil ways, for why will you die, O house of Israel?<br />12 “And you, son of man, say to your people, The righteousness of the righteous shall not deliver him when he transgresses, and as for the wickedness of the wicked, he shall not fall by it when he turns from his wickedness, and the righteous shall not be able to live by his righteousness when he sins. 13 Though I say to the righteous that he shall surely live, yet if he trusts in his righteousness and does injustice, none of his righteous deeds shall be remembered, but in his injustice that he has done he shall die.<br />14 Again, though I say to the wicked, ‘You shall surely die,’ yet if he turns from his sin and does what is just and right, 15 if the wicked restores the pledge, gives back what he has taken by robbery, and walks in the statutes of life, not doing injustice, he shall surely live; he shall not die. 16 None of the sins that he has committed shall be remembered against him. He has done what is just and right; he shall surely live.<br />17 “Yet your people say, ‘The way of YHWH is not just,’ when it is their own way that is not just. 18 When the righteous turns from his righteousness and does injustice, he shall die for it. 19 And when the wicked turns from his wickedness and does what is just and right, he shall live by this. 20 Yet you say, ‘The way of YHWH is not just.’ O house of Israel, I will judge each of you according to his ways.”<br />-Ezekiel 33:10-20calianahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06702074438747578526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-52545236576091531372010-03-18T14:24:13.892-04:002010-03-18T14:24:13.892-04:00Don't know where you get this bit about people...<i>Don't know where you get this bit about people in heaven 'getting to' watch people (not in heaven) suffering for eternity, but that's just not anything I have ever heard of before. <br /><br />No one that I know of would find such a thing desirable or some kind of retribution at all.</i><br /><br />You are quite wrong, and that's all there is to it. It is a ubiquitous belief within the evangelical subculture.Jeff Eygeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11967707883565162538noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-39851509108344613942010-03-18T13:43:43.883-04:002010-03-18T13:43:43.883-04:00A: "Take Caliana, for example. She doesn'...A: "Take Caliana, for example. She doesn't even recognize ridicule for what it is - seeing it only as an invitation to move further into the deep end of the most perverse forms of rationalization."<br /><br />How would you handle, deal with, take ridicule from a person who is dying? Based on that, I'll keep my hand out to you no matter what you say. I know it that looks irrational to you. It looks anything but irrational to me. <br /><br />I may seem a bit abrupt (black and white) sometimes but I have nothing but compassion for you.calianahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06702074438747578526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-55712989918930318772010-03-18T13:27:03.358-04:002010-03-18T13:27:03.358-04:00Ci,
Don't know where you get this bit about ...Ci, <br /><br />Don't know where you get this bit about people in heaven 'getting to' watch people (not in heaven) suffering for eternity, but that's just not anything I have ever heard of before. <br /><br />No one that I know of would find such a thing desirable or some kind of retribution at all. Get that out of your head. I would assume that people who share with you simply do so because if there is a judgment (which I believe there is) rightfully, I, or we, would NOT WANT to see you there. <br /><br />2000 yr old book of fables? With well over 25,000 manuscripts? I don't think so.calianahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06702074438747578526noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-49088600720592899992010-03-18T13:04:52.025-04:002010-03-18T13:04:52.025-04:00Darek W,
Doesn't it seem ironic that those mo...Darek W,<br /><br />Doesn't it seem ironic that those most likely to speak of the value of absolute truths are also those most likely to have highly postmodern, relativistic views of facts? One would think they wouldn't want to play as fast and loose as they do, wouldn't one?<br /><br />You deserve credit for giving it the good fight, no matter how frustrating and ultimately fruitless.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16038143823260179846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-11150848330435836502010-03-18T12:58:10.227-04:002010-03-18T12:58:10.227-04:00Wow, such a lot of heat.
Way back up in the first ...Wow, such a lot of heat.<br />Way back up in the first comment Mann'sWord said: "the public sphere has become so inhospitable to the Christian faith".<br /><br />Massimo called that laughable and I have to agree. My wife and I seriously considered home schooling for our two girls precisely because the public schools were too supportive of Christian faith. In the end we chose public schooling anyway and were moderately satisfied. Still, I'm sorry to see MP so adamantly opposed to home schooling (and vouchers I suspect). It's a tool. Like a hammer and saw, it could be used to build a church or it could be used to build a science lab. Denigrating the tools because some fools use them to build churches is unreasonable.<br />In our area (south Florida) something like 25 - 30% of students that start 9th grade drop out before they finish. < http://www.fldoe.org/eias/eiaspubs/word/gradrate0809.doc > And of the ones that complete 4 years, some still don't pass, and a good many end up as C and D students. The public schools don't have that great of a track record. So some parents fail at teaching... the school system fails at teaching too. And some parents will do a better job than the schools. Finally, MP's concern about socialization is a red herring. There are tons of non-school programs out there for art, music, sports, nature, agriculture, etc. Plenty of chances for kids to socialize when not hitting the books.Die Anywayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10632857696534495049noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-12925687930830698292010-03-18T12:25:27.542-04:002010-03-18T12:25:27.542-04:00Yeah, it granted a monopoly to teaching supported ...Yeah, it granted a monopoly to teaching supported facts about the world... what a terrible thing. It would have been more 'democratic' if they allowed kids to be 'open-minded' about unsupported ideas and claims about the world...<br /><br />That last comment wasn't me re-engaging with you. It was setting the record straight and trying to account for my venting in frustration. I wish your kids good luck in the world.Darek Whttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02037047693722842169noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-1526852319652277982010-03-18T12:04:09.503-04:002010-03-18T12:04:09.503-04:00Darek,
I’ll just address your statement since Mel...Darek,<br /><br />I’ll just address your statement since Mel is dropping out of the conversation:<br /><br />“You do in fact have the freedom to be as ignorant as you want to be on whichever subjects you find contentious to your beliefs, but your children shouldn't have to be subject to it just because they're your children.”<br /><br />Well, who is to decide about our children? The monolithic State or the parents? When children reach the age where they can evaluate the evidence, I’m all in favor of presenting both sides of the discussion. However, you are very content with “Kitzmiller” which has granted the State a virtual monopoly on the teaching of evolution. It fined the school board $1,000,000 for simply requiring that biology teachers preface their teaching of evolution with a statement saying that there is another side to the story and that there is a book in the library that presents it.<br /><br />However, this represented too much competition for the evolution establishment, which wants to maintain absolute control on what is taught about their naturalistic worldview. They want to have the veto power to censor anything that enters into their classrooms and to proselytize without interference.<br /><br />This type of imperialistic thought control can only lead to stagnation and group-think.Daniel Mannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13952453459481872105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-1448980181380512132010-03-18T11:18:09.353-04:002010-03-18T11:18:09.353-04:00MannsWord,
Look. This discussion has centered aro...MannsWord,<br /><br />Look. This discussion has centered around teaching facts. The topic of the thread deals with how homeschooling is a way for people to avoid teaching them.<br /><br />You are trying to argue that this is in fact free speech (when I am arguing it is controlling it). You call this freedom. I call it megalomania supported by religious dogma run amok.<br /><br />Now, in recent comments, you behave as if all along, what we're really talking about is first graders and raising kids. First graders don't even get taught things like biology, so its a complete avoidance of the topic at hand and people raise good children all the time while *not* keeping them away from facts like evolution - which is a better description of the kind of democracy you claim you support.<br /><br />You want your cake and shove it down your childrens throats. In your view any contradicting views is 'authoritarian'. Any facts about the world that is agreed upon by the scientific process is really the work of fascist regimes.<br /><br />You do in fact have the freedom to be as ignorant as you want to be on whichever subjects you find contentious to your beliefs, but your children shouldn't have to be subject to it just because they're your children.<br /><br />My frustrations have been more than evident but hey, all I feel I did was call a spade a spade.Darek Whttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02037047693722842169noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-54421811196162432052010-03-18T10:33:20.723-04:002010-03-18T10:33:20.723-04:00"...history is a problematic arena for argume..."...history is a problematic arena for argumentation about the viability of a philosophy or worldview."<br /><br />Which I wasn't doing, but you were.<br /><br />"You claim that today’s Muslim nations are backward because they have been subjected to invasion and warfare more than the Christian West."<br /><br />No, that wasn't what I claimed. It suffered severed disruption at different times in its development that altered that development. I stressed that they have had a different history over the last 1000 years - there are many events that make a history. You, however, are choosing to simplify and ignore in favor of an ideological view of history.<br /><br />The rest of your comment about Islam and the West simply makes no sense, and if you looked at history, you would see this. <br /><br />"In contrast to this, whichever Western nation had devoted itself to the Bible has become more advanced." <br /><br />And this makes no sense, either. If you were to go and read a book or two, you would see this. Your insults of Catholicism and Orthodoxy are similarly nonsensical. It seems what you are talking about isn't even Christianity, but your idea of Christianity as being formative to the West. That is a purely ideological position, and one that is largely ahistorical, as your form of Christianity hasn't existed all that long. Again, read a book or two. <br /><br />And I don't understand why you come around to attacking atheism. I haven't said anything about atheism, and I am no interested in doing so. I sought to correct you on a baldly incorrect statement about Western civilization that was completely at odds with the historical record, and with the facts of the matter that Christianity, while of major importance to the development of the West after Constantine, it was not, in and of itself, the whole of the the thing. It seems you are arguing from a purely ideological point of view, and have little interest in the world beyond it, as well as little capacity for seeing the world except through its lens. I have found that it is a fool's errand to attempt to discuss anything with such a person, and so I won't bother. If you are interested in honestly discussing history outside of a blinkered ideological viewpoint, then we can do that, but as you are showing yourself to be, no. Fruere bono diem.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16038143823260179846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-26945213343435545822010-03-18T09:07:15.605-04:002010-03-18T09:07:15.605-04:00People,
just a reminder that I invite vigorous de...People,<br /><br />just a reminder that I invite vigorous debate on this forum, but not personal insult or abusive language, ok?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09099460671669064269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-66521655122002369842010-03-18T09:04:18.870-04:002010-03-18T09:04:18.870-04:00Darek (and others),
By accusing me of having a “d...Darek (and others),<br /><br />By accusing me of having a “disingenuous nature,” you are making a serious and unsupported charge. While I admitted that I would want my first grader raised with my values, this in no way makes my assertion about diversity and free speech hypocritical! And you have failed to demonstrate otherwise.<br /><br />While atheists strenuously want to convince the world that they can be good without God, my own experience has proved otherwise. Perhaps you can be good superficially, but when you are frustrated and the veneer is penetrated, all forms of abusive, malevolent language come forth. <br /><br />Democracy is only as viable as the character of its members. I think we are facing hard times.<br /><br />• Proverbs 14:34 Righteousness exalts a nation, but sin is a disgrace to any people.Daniel Mannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13952453459481872105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-9543672587829142232010-03-18T06:56:19.801-04:002010-03-18T06:56:19.801-04:00Mel,
While I appreciate some of the things that y...Mel,<br /><br />While I appreciate some of the things that you related, you undermine it all by slipping into groundless, malicious, ad hominem attacks. Indeed, history is a problematic arena for argumentation about the viability of a philosophy or worldview. It becomes too easy to cherry-pick the facts – and there is almost an endless supply of them – in order to paint whatever biased portrait one so desires to construct. So let’s try to take in the wide panorama.<br /><br />You claim that today’s Muslim nations are backward because they have been subjected to invasion and warfare more than the Christian West. However, this doesn’t seem adequate to explain the phenomena that we encounter. There are NO Muslim nations that are technological/scientific leaders – whether we look towards Muslim nations in Europe (Albania and Bosnia are probably the most Muslim), Africa or Asia. In fact, the more that a Muslim nation has devoted itself to being Koranic, the more backward it has become (with the exception of oil-rich countries, which can buy whatever they so desire despite their dysfunctionality.)<br /><br />In contrast to this, whichever Western nation had devoted itself to the Bible has become more advanced. Eastern Orthodoxy especially and Catholicism have been embroiled with their own traditions. This has tended to efface the salutary effect of the Bible. Historian Rodney Stark reasserts how the Christian faith has elevated the world:<br /><br />• “Rather, the West is said to have surged ahead precisely as it overcame religious barriers…Nonsense, The success of the West, including the rise of science, rested entirely on religious foundations, and the people who brought it about were devout Christians.” (The Victory of Reason: How Christianity Led to Freedom, Capitalism, and Western Success, xi)<br /><br />I don’t think we have to wait long to be able to assess the impact of atheism. We have already seen the hideous fruit of the communist/atheist nations. In contrast, Psalmist’s words still ring true:<br /><br />• Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly... But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night. And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper. (Psalm 1:1-3).Daniel Mannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13952453459481872105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-35775483597412413772010-03-18T03:14:07.231-04:002010-03-18T03:14:07.231-04:00I hope that some others will find the following ca...I hope that some others will find the following cartoon as relevant to this 'discussion' as I do: http://www.salon.com/entertainment/comics/tom_the_dancing_bug/2010/03/17/tom_the_dancing_bugKonrad Talmont-Kaminskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05136133369582249025noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-69366216096430440172010-03-17T23:58:45.705-04:002010-03-17T23:58:45.705-04:00MannsWord,
What kind of person are you? Are you r...MannsWord,<br /><br />What kind of person are you? Are you really this vacant of anything remotely honest? This is the second time we've had a discussion where you've ignored my previous comments and just continue to repeat yourself. (for those interested, <a href="http://rationallyspeaking.blogspot.com/2010/02/massimos-picks.html" rel="nofollow">see here</a>).<br /><br />First graders do not get taught biology. You must know this, so your request to be reasonable is once again trashed by your disingenuous nature. Teaching things like facts has been the topic of our entire discussion thus far, but you use all sorts of strawmen to weasel in and out of having to discuss anything substantially.<br /><br />You're just not a good person, my man, not by any stretch of the imagination. The experience has been exhausting and the impression poor. I'm sure we could grab a beer and share a few laughs about anything that doesn't relate to anything worthwhile, but even that would be all on the surface - below it, you're really the kind of person you fear others might become; beneath contempt.Darek Whttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02037047693722842169noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-71488779275359271992010-03-17T22:14:32.463-04:002010-03-17T22:14:32.463-04:00Moreover, the emphasis on the West as being the We...Moreover, the emphasis on the West as being the West purely due to the Christian tradition that has influenced it is really nonsensical. The West is more complex than that. If it were not, then Ethiopia would have to be considered the West, as it went Christian before anywhere else, and yet it lacked other parts of the key influences on Western evolution. Same with national formerly part of the Byzantine sphere of influence, which lack the distinctive barbarian aspects of western civilization. Same with Armenia. Same with Russia. They have all evolved as deeply influenced by Christianity, but they are not the West.<br /><br />I am left wondering where you are coming from. Are you really this ignorant of Western history, or of history at all? Is this intentional ignorance, or the product of ideological blindness? Because your position is not informed by the facts of history and culture, and that speaks very ill of you. Go and do some reading, because you have a goodly number of distinct deficits in your knowledge to see to. As it stands, you are doing neither yourself nor your faith any credit.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16038143823260179846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-56396968418193541712010-03-17T22:08:23.042-04:002010-03-17T22:08:23.042-04:00Mann's Word,
The Islamic world was heir to pa...Mann's Word,<br /><br />The Islamic world was heir to part of the same traditions that fed into the development of the Western world after the fall of the Western empire, true. However, it is really overly simplifying things to say that the fact that the two are in different places today because of the Christian influence in the West. If you were to look back a thousand years ago, you would have been able to make the opposite claim, as the Islamic world was home to a brilliantly thriving culture that was far more advanced, learned, literate, tolerant, and humane than Western Europe, or really anywhere else but the Byzantine and Chinese empires. The differences that have since accrued have been due to differences in subsequent history. The Islamic empire suffered recurrent barbarian invasions and reacted by entering a period of reflexive conservatism that placed hope for renewal in a downplaying of learning in favor of increased fundamentalism. Then they suffered the full force of the Mongol invasions of the fourteenth century. Europe didn't face that. It had the black death, which shook up social conventions, it had later fortuitous agricultural innovations, and it benefited greatly from the influx of scholars from Constantinople during the final years of the Eastern empire (this influx led to what we call the Renaissance). And there was a lot more after that. <br /> The fact of the matter is that there was a lot more to making the modern world than just the inheritance of the ancient world, and that cannot be ignored. I honestly don't understand why you are being so obtuse about this.<br /> I fully agree that Christianity has played a highly significant part in the development of the West since Rome. To argue otherwise would be foolish at best. And yes, as the quote you used indicates, that heritage includes a distinct strain of charity that was not found earlier. However, through most of Western history, that strain has not been particularly prominent. I would, however, point out that your quote also shows a distinct disregard for actual history. Through much of its history, Christianity has not really been associated with improved literacy in the West. Slavery was pretty well accepted in the Christian world for most of its history, as well. Christian missionaries also acted as agents of conquest and imperialism, as well as social and cultural destruction. Warfield seems blind to this, but he did write in the 19th century, when such blindness was common.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16038143823260179846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-80921867066775144612010-03-17T21:03:22.156-04:002010-03-17T21:03:22.156-04:00Hospitals and asylums and refuges for the sick
Of...<i>Hospitals and asylums and refuges for the sick</i><br /><br />Of course, because no one ever showed any compassion until Jesus was born. None of this would have happened had the dominant ideology in the West been Jewish, or Pagan, or Muslim: <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bimaristan" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bimaristan</a>Jeff Eygeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11967707883565162538noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-40088423639127708102010-03-17T20:15:56.566-04:002010-03-17T20:15:56.566-04:00"I have not intention of getting into any dis..."I have not intention of getting into any discussion with such individuals as doing so is a mug's game as it makes the quite false assumption that one's interlocutor is open to rational argumentation and evidence."<br />But what if the goal were to see how far their arguments could be skewed in response to an effective use of ridicule? Take Caliana, for example. She doesn't even recognize ridicule for what it is - seeing it only as an invitation to move further into the deep end of the most perverse forms of rationalization.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-3194406212743592782010-03-17T17:54:06.010-04:002010-03-17T17:54:06.010-04:00Mel,
You responded, “So are you excluding the ent...Mel,<br /><br />You responded, “So are you excluding the entire product of the ancient world? You really consider Sophocles, Plato, Aristotle, and Euripides to not be the flower of the western world?” <br /><br />I certainly don’t leave these gentlemen out of the equation, but you must note that the Islamic world was also heir to this tradition. However, there is little comparison between this world and the Christian West. How would you explain that?<br /><br />Instead, we can understand the West by recognizing its distinctive Christian inheritance. The 19th century Princeton theologian, B.B. Warfield, wrote,<br /><br />• “Hospitals and asylums and refuges for the sick, the miserable and the afflicted grow like heaven-bedewed blossoms in its path. Woman, whose equality with man Plato considered a sure mark of social disorganization, has been elevated; slavery has been driven from civilized ground; literacy has been given by Christian missionaries, under the influence of the Bible.” (The Works of Benjamin B. Warfield)<br /><br />This is partly because the Bible established our responsibility to all people. As Jesus taught:<br /><br />• "You have heard that it was said, 'Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.' But I tell you: Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? (Matthew 5:43-46)Daniel Mannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13952453459481872105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-46112596780140304692010-03-17T17:24:26.627-04:002010-03-17T17:24:26.627-04:00Western Civilization – at least its flower – was t...Western Civilization – at least its flower – was the product of a Biblical faith.<br /><br />So are you excluding the entire product of the ancient world? You really consider Sophocles, Plato, Aristotle, and Euripides to not be the flower of the western world? Perhaps you mean after the fall of the western empire? In which case you have the problem of the fact that the civilization and culture that thereafter arose in Western Europe was the product of a synthesis of Christianity (itself very much the product of a synthesis of Judaism, Zoroastrianism, and neo-Platonism, later Roman imperial culture with all its attendant strains from a myriad of ancient cultures, and pre-existing barbarian cultures. To insist Western Culture is entirely a product of Christianity requires either monumental ignorance of Western Culture or simple monumental self-deception (or, less charitably, monumental dishonesty). Which is it in your case?Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16038143823260179846noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-89162549893610438022010-03-17T17:16:06.913-04:002010-03-17T17:16:06.913-04:00Sorry, that last comment should have been addresse...Sorry, that last comment should have been addressed to Mann's Word. Meh - six or one.Jeff Eygeshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11967707883565162538noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-10467671586866581082010-03-17T17:07:39.776-04:002010-03-17T17:07:39.776-04:00Darek,
While I do have a high regard for free spe...Darek,<br /><br />While I do have a high regard for free speech and democratic processes and protections, this in no way contradicts my desire to raise my children according to my values and what I regard as truth.<br /><br />Please be reasonable – none of us allow first-graders to choose their curriculum. We all agree that they are in no position to make those kinds of choices. Indeed, we all engage in thought-control regarding first-graders.<br /><br />Once again, the question is, in their regards, who is to exercise that thought-control. According to you, it should be an authoritarian State, while I believe that the ideal state should be willing to allow a certain degree of diversity and competition.<br /><br />While you call me a “fascist,” you haven’t been able to identify anything that I’ve said by which you can justify this charge. Consequently, your charge is no more than name-calling.Daniel Mannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13952453459481872105noreply@blogger.com