tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post7586030762037007200..comments2023-10-10T08:02:18.073-04:00Comments on Rationally Speaking: Michael’s PicksUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-47466415115192396282012-05-12T02:15:07.063-04:002012-05-12T02:15:07.063-04:00Actually, per the "peas" column in the N...Actually, per the "peas" column in the NYT, even if its author overhypes recent findings, vegans don't have much room for moral food superiority.<br /><br />You want to feel superior about what's on your dinner plate or not? Become a "sky-clad" Jain and deliberately starve yourself to death.Gadflyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13075757287807731373noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-86055482579439977682012-05-12T02:11:41.891-04:002012-05-12T02:11:41.891-04:00Great column by Kolkert; finally reading somebody ...Great column by Kolkert; finally reading somebody who agrees with me! That said, I'm "shocked" that an economist from George Mason (aka U. of Chicago east) makes a conservative moralistic argument for breeding like rabbits.Gadflyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13075757287807731373noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-38211744747293128502012-05-09T08:28:55.047-04:002012-05-09T08:28:55.047-04:00Eamon,
that's a long discussion, but no, I do...Eamon,<br /><br />that's a long discussion, but no, I don't think of myself as an ethical realist in that sense. My views are more along the lines of ethical reasoning being like mathematical reasoning: IF you start with certain assumptions THEN certain things follow. (Of course, as you know, there are mathematical realists out there...)<br /><br />So one of my starting assumptions is that using people exclusively for personal advantage is not good, and another is that causing unnecessary pain to sentient beings is also not good. And when I encounter people who embrace too much of an exploitative / cause suffering ethos I simply avoid them.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09099460671669064269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-81374894022314358452012-05-08T19:16:01.551-04:002012-05-08T19:16:01.551-04:00I could go on and argue that since I myself would ...I could go on and argue that since I myself would like others to intervene and reduce my suffering when feasible should such a state of affairs occur, I should assist in alleviating the suffering of others when feasible should such a state of affairs occur. Again, you see how chickens, cows, and horses are not a part of this equation.Cian Eamon Marleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09070168038290681070noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-38919247671001041082012-05-08T19:11:48.391-04:002012-05-08T19:11:48.391-04:00Massimo,
Our disagreement begins at base with wha...Massimo,<br /><br />Our disagreement begins at base with what we take the nature of morality to be. I subscribe to a moral error theory because I see no extra-linguistic reality that corresponds to moral propositions. So, in a strict sense, I take all moral propositions to be false. It seems to me you, like Singer, are a moral realist (in some sense, at least) and wish to make some pretty metaphysically significant moral claims. So, e.g., you think one has a moral duty to reduce suffering when possible (or when the reduction does not correspond to some increased suffering on your part), and I do not. Morality, for me, is a strategic means-end reasoning process for agents similarly disposed as us. Empathy of course plays a significant role in so-called moral reasoning, and we can explain why humans have empathic responses to other sentient beings, especially humans, but empathy does not make true moral propositions. The ability to empathize is simply one aspect which contributes to the moral reasoning process. <br /><br />That said, do you really believe that if I do not malign non-human animal suffering I cannot consistently malign human suffering? Why can I not malign human suffering with something like: "Well, I myself would like not to suffer. If I intentionally cause (or attempt to cause) suffering in others, they may cause (or attempt to cause) suffering in me. Thus, I ought not to cause (or attempt to cause) suffering in others."<br /><br />As is obvious, such a reasoning process would exclude non-rational sentient life.Cian Eamon Marleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09070168038290681070noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-40303730752614353572012-05-08T15:37:59.663-04:002012-05-08T15:37:59.663-04:00Eamon,
Well, by that token, why should you give a...Eamon,<br /><br />Well, by that token, why should you give a shit about the suffering of any animal capable of suffering, including humans?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09099460671669064269noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-16443195804898782612012-05-08T15:32:18.299-04:002012-05-08T15:32:18.299-04:00Agreed, and in addition, why should I give a shit ...Agreed, and in addition, why should I give a shit about the physical suffering of chickens or cows?Cian Eamon Marleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09070168038290681070noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-8435370953580170662012-05-08T14:53:48.540-04:002012-05-08T14:53:48.540-04:00Well, I can think of one: Is fucking delicious.Well, I can think of one: Is fucking delicious.RafaelMonteirohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11815211206855319212noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15005476.post-34720671748287529232012-05-08T03:23:28.847-04:002012-05-08T03:23:28.847-04:00I as hoping that "Justify your dinner" c...I as hoping that "Justify your dinner" contest would produce something new and/or worthwhile (despite the well-published and well merited, objections to the judges). I was disappointed: a few "raise them right" and "earth balance" types and others who don't seem to be arguing to justify meat-eating at all. Nothing to change my vegan way of life, it still makes more sense than these essays do. Perhaps there really ISN'T any justification for killing-and-ruining-the-planet to eat?Cavall de Querhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17687910584661433398noreply@blogger.com